The Importance of Mentoring in Our Lives and Careers

Adrian McIntyre: 00:00:04

That was Sir Isaac Newton in: 1675

It's: 2025

Abbie, I know this is important to you. What's on your mind?

Abbie Fink: 00:00:35

That's quite the setup! Well, what's on my mind truly is this concept of mentoring.

Over the last handful of weeks, I've had several conversations, soon to be graduating seniors that are embarking on their career exploration, and "what do I do and how do I do it, and how do I set myself apart?" A couple conversations with some colleagues that are kind of stuck and just trying to figure out what it's going to look like. And the conversations and the back and forth and such were really, really interesting to me.

I've been doing this mentoring or advising or informational interviews or whatever you want to call it forever. It seems like it's been part of my mindset to offer whatever conversation and advice I can to professionals that are considering public relations as a career.

But I do think it's become increasingly more important to develop these relationships and have folks in your world that you can call on and talk through some things. And whether that's advising and mentoring the up and coming or seeking out those that are your equals or your contemporaries and offering recommendations there, it's so critically important.

And with networking changing so much, because in-person events have changed significantly over the last handful of years, and, you know, really, how do you set yourself apart? So it was just a bonus that it happened to be National Mentoring Month. And I thought, well, let's chat about that a little bit today.

Adrian McIntyre: 00:02:13

You know, it's interesting. As I think back over my own somewhat twisted and torturous career -- I mean, I always found the detours more interesting than the road -- I certainly have been influenced and guided by mentors. And I don't think I sought them out for that reason.

I didn't go looking for a mentor, but there were people in my life who were wiser, were more insightful. Some of them were older, but some of them were peer mentors as well. And as I was reflecting on this, you said this is the topic you wanted to explore, I realized that for me personally, and this may be different for everybody, the value I've gotten from mentors and my own particular practice is they've shown me not what to think, but how to think.

In other words, I was able to work alongside them in situations where, you know, quite frankly, I was in over my head in many cases.

One of my great mentors, although we didn't spend that much time together in the grand scheme of things, was just a phenomenal journalist, Christopher Dickey. He died a few years ago, tragically. But for many, many years he was a leading correspondent for the Washington Post. And then he was the Middle East Bureau Chief for Newsweek when I met him.

uring the invasion of Iraq in: 2003

I mean, the way he would network, the way he would deal with sources, the way he would interact with younger journalists. It was just a phenomenal experience and left a deep impression on me that I'm really grateful for, even though I don't practice journalism. And he's now gone, but he's not gone. And I think that's the impact a great mentor can have.

Abbie Fink: 00:04:01

Well, and I think what's so powerful in that story is you weren't setting out to find a mentor mentee relationship. And it was observation. It was his willingness to allow you into that space to observe what was happening and participate with him and be alongside him.

And I think some of the best relationships I have developed, whether I am the mentor or I am the mentee, are really the ones that are really that deep and honest kind of conversation.

I mean, I do lots of informational interviews with young up and coming professionals or re careers people that are looking to get into public relations. And, you know, they'll have their, their standard questions about, you know, what was your journey, how did you get there? What advice would you offer? You know, the stuff that sort of sets the groundwork for what they're looking for.

But the relationships that have turned into what I would consider more of a mentoring relationship are really those that continue beyond that initial conversation, and it's not formalized in any way.

I will always offer, you know, "if there's anything else I can help you out with, if you need any other resources, recommendations or whatever, please reach out." Some do, some don't.

Those that do, and they start to develop into more than just, you know, "can you take a look at my resume?" But, you know, "I'm really struggling with this." Or "I had a fantastic interview and I want to make sure that I stay in front of them. What else can I be doing?" What else, you know, and that move along in the conversation are so powerful.

And I think back over the course of my career and really before I would have identified it as a career, you know, some of my professors that I had in school that I continue to stay in touch with that have offered, you know, advice and guidance and counsel over the years, folks that have nothing to do with public relations at all, but have set an example of what a good woman in business might look like, what a good leader might look like, what a good friend would look like. And those are very meaningful relationships to have.

And I think where the power for me is, they're both ways, you know, even if I'm set up to be the mentor, I always am learning something from the individual that is seeking out my information if I ask the right kinds of questions as well. Because it's not, I don't think it's a, an age guidance that the older one has to be the mentor and the younger has to be the mentee. I think you can get that value regardless of age in those relationships.

Adrian McIntyre: 00:06:52

You know, it's interesting, the word that we use for this comes from ancient Greek. In the Odyssey by Homer, Odysseus's son Telemachus is placed under the guidance, if you will, of an older man who was a friend of Odysseus as he's going off to fight in the Trojan War. But in the Greek myth it's actually the goddess Athena, the goddess of wisdom, who embodies, takes on the form of this older man named Mentor and becomes this wise and trusted advisor.

s of that that don't apply in: 2025

Abbie Fink: 00:07:42

Although I do like that! I don't mind if you want to refer to it that way.

Adrian McIntyre: 00:07:47

So what do you think is required to make it work? There are no gods on Mount Olympus pulling the strings here behind the scenes. So it takes something from both the mentor and the mentee. So what do you think makes a great relationship?

Abbie Fink: 00:08:00

Right, well, and I think it's, you know, starting with the mentee side of things. So there's certainly a recognition that you need or want advice, counsel, conversation, friendship with someone that can offer you some value, right? I'm thinking about a career in public relations. I'm going to surround myself with some individuals that I value in that role. Great.

A willingness to, you know, listen and absorb. Not everything you hear is going to be valuable to you, but that willingness to listen, to be curious and ask really good questions and then, you know, contemplate the information that you've given.

And I think when I hear back from individuals that I've had these conversations with, whether it's right away or several years down the path that come back and say, "That was so great, having that conversation about X, I didn't realize how important was going to be. It has guided me, it has helped me do this..." whatever it is. It's so powerful as the mentor to hear back and get that feedback.

From the mentor perspective, you've got to be open to almost the exact same things. You have to be willing to listen for the nuggets in those questions. What are they really asking you about? Open yourself up a little, be a little vulnerable. They're going to learn from your experiences, your anecdotes, the way that you've addressed a similar situation.

And for both sides, it's really -- although, again, I would like to be considered the goddess of wisdom ... I don't know all the answers, but I'm willing to have that conversation. And ideally, we're both going to learn something from each other and mentor-mentee relationships are valuable in the moment that they're happening, but they're also valuable in the years to come.

And there's absolutely no reason why, you know, they may have fulfilled the initial purpose, but that you don't look for opportunities to continue those relationships in whatever fashion they may form over the course of time because you really don't know where your paths are going to cross again and how that initial connection might not lead you and guide you into something else.

Adrian McIntyre: 00:10:31

It occurs to me as I reflect on other people that have played an influential role in my development, and I mean professional development -- skills, insights, practices -- that one of the things that was really valuable was the opportunity to get feedback in the moment.

So that's different from giving advice because, you know, if I were to have called them up and said, "Hey, I'm thinking about X, Y or Z, what do you think? What would you do?" I might have gotten a good answer. And it might or might not have helped me.

But when we were working together or near each other, alongside each other, at least in the same realm, there was an opportunity for them to provide helpful, constructive feedback. Some of it I didn't want to hear, quite honestly, because they were pointing out ways in which I had undermined something we were trying to do.

I'm thinking specifically here of media relations and policy / advocacy work. In my humanitarian aid worker years, we were doing some quite high stakes things. Meeting with ambassadors to the United nations from different countries around the world, trying to get language introduced into Security Council Resolutions to protect civilians in places like Sudan, Darfur, Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories, Liberia, Uganda. So it really mattered.

And the way we would interact with these seasoned diplomats was part of how we would accomplish our goals. It wasn't just what we said, it was how we behaved. And quite honestly, I'd never been in that situation before and I mean, I'm certainly ... I have decent social skills, but there was specific things where they were able to say, "Hey, let's try this or let's do that." And that kind of feedback was invaluable because you can't get that in a classroom, you can't get that from a book.

I think, for example, of some of the work that you and I both do, although we do it differently. In media training, for example, when someone needs to speak to the media and they've never done it before, they can't just read a guidebook that tells them what to do. They need to practice and they need feedback.

And that aspect of mentorship is harder to come by because it takes more time together and time is a scarce resource. What are your thoughts on the role of feedback? Obviously, for employees in a firm, that's one thing. You spend more time with them, you have more access to them, they expect that kind of nurturing and guidance. But for people that aren't working directly together, or if someone was seeking out a mentor, how would you even approach that?

Abbie Fink: 00:12:49

You used the word "influence." People that have had influence on you, and the reason I believe that they had influence on you was your willingness to allow what they were sharing with you to be influential.

So I can give you feedback and you can say you don't know what you're talking about and move on, right? But if I give you feedback that you're willing to listen to, and you are open to the idea that maybe a different perspective is worth considering, then the feedback matters.

Now, there's a skill involved in giving feedback that is not constructive criticism. To me that's still a criticism, and so it's not feedback anymore.

But feedback that, you know, "this is what I observed. Theese are some things to consider from my experience I might recommend." And that guidance becomes the kind of feedback that actually then is something you can implement and move forward.

And I know in my own sphere, when I catch myself and change the direction, that that is a result of some feedback I had received. And I catch myself, oh, you know, what I'm about to do, what I've been suggested I might think differently about and I correct the course and go in a different direction. We're not perfect at it. Giving feedback can be difficult, Receiving feedback can be difficult. But a willingness from both sides to do that.

And generally speaking, if I'm going to be in that relationship, I'm going to ask for permission to provide you with some feedback. "You know, Adrian, I observed a couple things. Would you be open to the idea of me sharing with you some feedback or some thoughts on what you might consider if you find yourself in that situation again?" If you say yes, fantastic. If you say "No, I appreciate it, but I'm good." Okay, that's great. There's no harm, no foul there.

And it's probably important to say that we started the conversation here in that mentorship, more lengthy, maybe long-term type of commitment to each other. You can mentor in a brief 10-minute conversation as well, if someone is open to the idea of that kind of feedback.

You mentioned talking to employees. We have this conversation in the office when we're getting ready for a new business presentation. Before COVID we'd be in the room with each other presenting, and we had little hand signals and little gestures that would advise you that you're going down that path I don't want you to.

You and I do that here on our podcast. We have hand signals over the screen to make sure we know what we're talking about. Well, now we can't do that next to each other. So we've had to create some different ways to do that. More virtual mentoring and guidance and feedback.

But there's so much benefit in my view personally, when I get the opportunity to have these kinds of conversations with others, and whether I'm in the receiving or in the giving of the information, I find so much value in having them.

And they exist because both sides of those conversations want to impart information, wisdom and accept it for the reason that it's being given.

And if it dates back to Greek mythology, this idea that we were given guiding others and sharing expertise, I think that's a pretty amazing thing that that idea has existed and that you can seek out these relationships virtually anywhere. It doesn't have to be within your professional colleagues. It can be friend to friend. It can be with another family member that might be have had some particularly important influence in your life.

And I think there's nothing more important than the thank you that follows that and sharing the good information that you got and what it meant to you by receiving it and how you put that into action.

I get so much joy when I hear back from individuals that say, "I really heard what you had to say, and as a result I'm on this path now," or "I've done something about it and I'm just so appreciative of that."

And I think it's important to recognize because sometimes we don't know that what we've said is making any kind of a difference, but it's pretty amazing when we hear back that it has. And it's really what fuels that energy for me to keep that mentoring kind of relationship going, however it presents itself.

Adrian McIntyre: 00:17:27

Thanks for listening to this episode of Copper State of Mind. If you enjoyed the conversation, please share it with a colleague who might also find this podcast valuable.

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The show is recorded and produced by the team at Speed of Story, a B2B communications firm in Phoenix, and distributed by PHX.fm, the leading independent B2B podcast network in Arizona.

For all of us here at Speed of Story and PHX.fm, I'm Adrian McIntyre. Thanks for listening and for sharing the show with others if you choose to do so. We hope you'll join us again for another episode of Copper State of Mind.